Just general to start. There's everything from low volume surfboard, to high volume pedal craft, to wide beamed recreational, to Jon boats.


Nothing here is written in stone, just throw out ideas and feel free to say why.

The big questions is which category should lead off.



Low Volume

Medium Volume

High Volume



Hard Chined Narrow

Soft Chined Narrow

Hard Chined-Wide

Soft-Chined Wide



Paddle

Pedal Drive

Prop Drive


Surf

Recreational

Touring SOT

Surf Ski



10 foot and less
12 foot and less
14 foot and less
16 foot and less
18 foot and less

I would include a "Sail" category in there too, since some yaks sail much better than others. And what about "Price Range?"

And how do you deal with canoes that are marketed as kayaks? The Native Ultimate comes to mind.

Most people, I believe, won't understand chine....why not label primary and secondary stability. Eliminating wide and narrow.

sorry, missed the question...

10 foot high primary high secondary stabilty recreational and finish with 18 foot, poor primary, poor secondary touring. Just two cents. Scott

quote:

Originally posted by LunaSea:
I would include a "Sail" category in there too, since some yaks sail much better than others. And what about "Price Range?"

And how do you deal with canoes that are marketed as kayaks? The Native Ultimate comes to mind.

The Natives are a good example as to why this is a useful pursuit. There's so much out there to choose from and they don't all fit in a simple category.

What I'm shooting for here is a way to differentiate SOTs into identifiable categories for easy reference to let people know what kayaks work for what purpose. For instance, if someone says, "I want a kayak to fish in the surf", or "I want one one to do stand up fishing", you should be able to say "take a look at this type of boat"

I'm looking for an intelligent way to categorize to let people know what's out there. From most of what I read most people barely understand what their options are and most retailers can't or won't help them.

I know some people want a kayak to do everything, but that's the problem I see. All boats are compromises and people get attached to their brand preference, believing they have the best boat out there. We all know there is no such thing as a perfect boat, and there are no useless kayaks, just kayaks with limited applications


So what are the most general categories to divide boats by hull performance and function?

quote:

Originally posted by Scott:
Most people, I believe, won't understand chine....why not label primary and secondary stability. Eliminating wide and narrow.

Primary and secondary are good ways to do it.

Can we use "beam" as a general category to differentiate primary and secondary, even though shape is a better predictor?

quote:

Originally posted by Scott:
sorry, missed the question...

10 foot high primary high secondary stabilty recreational and finish with 18 foot, poor primary, poor secondary touring. Just two cents. Scott

Now how do we work in propulsion mechanisms and other performance categories.

quote:

Originally posted by LunaSea:
I would include a "Sail" category in there too, since some yaks sail much better than others. And what about "Price Range?"

And how do you deal with canoes that are marketed as kayaks? The Native Ultimate comes to mind.

I thin we might have zoom out to say:

Open Canoe:

Semi-Enclosed Canoe:

Closed Canoe:

Closed Cockpit Kayak:

Hybrid Open/Closed Kayak:

Open Cockpit Kayak:

http://www.sit-on-topkayaking.com/Articles/Instruction/HullDesign.htm

Beam is a function of width not of hull characteristics/design. I'm trying t look at this from the developmental framework, maybe using a family tree kind of diagram, some branches lead to additional branches and some just stop. Certainly a hobie outback and FnD share many common characteristics but differentiate in propulsion. Are they more alike or disimilar??? A branch leading off of canoe would probabl yend in natives, no??? Scott

quote:

Originally posted by Santiago II:

...

I thin we might have zoom out to say:

...

Don't forget "Monstrosity," "Perversion," "Transformer," and/or "Mutant." I'm pointing at you, Mokai and Freedom Hawk!!

I suppose there's also "sled/slab" for the 'stand and pole' barge designs that are akin to paddling a board of foam insulation (can't think of the name to post a link).

quote:

Originally posted by Scott:
Beam is a function of width not of hull characteristics/design. I'm trying t look at this from the developmental framework, maybe using a family tree kind of diagram, some branches lead to additional branches and some just stop. Certainly a hobie outback and FnD share many common characteristics but differentiate in propulsion. Are they more alike or disimilar??? A branch leading off of canoe would probabl yend in natives, no??? Scott

How do we make it simple and easily comprehensible?

quote:

Originally posted by sullivan504:

quote:

Originally posted by Santiago II:

...

I thin we might have zoom out to say:

...

Don't forget "Monstrosity," "Perversion," "Transformer," and/or "Mutant." I'm pointing at you, Mokai and Freedom Hawk!!

I suppose there's also "sled/slab" for the 'stand and pole' barge designs that are akin to paddling a board of foam insulation (can't think of the name to post a link).

But they count as well. If, as Scott suggests, we just look at an evolutionary tree we might be able to make some non-biased sense of all the products out there, then people can make up their own mind as to what they want (or more likely what they think they want).

Start with Greenland style kayaks, canoes, and surfboards as the evolutionary predecessors of everything we paddle today?

http://www.sit-on-topkayaking.com/KayakData/KayakStats7.asp

Based on this list at topkayaker, sub-dividing should be challenging.

quote:

Originally posted by Santiago II:

...
we might be able to make some non-biased sense of all the products out there, then people can make up their own mind as to what they want
...

Wow. How thoroughly fair and even-handed. This almost sounds like ...um... a darn good idea. What the heck is something like that doing in a forum I read?

go back to the early days and read. Scott

Where do you put Polynesian craft.

A surf ski is clearly a SOT.

But look at an OC-1. Almost the same hull but narrower.

Now ad an ama for balance.

And although some eskimos sailed, Polynesians were the greatest. As Luna Sea says add sailing.

This looks like a good project.

Let's use this as the basis for an evolutionary design of NA canoes and kayaks. At the end of the article we end up with K boats and C boats. Let's move up the evolutionary tree from there. SCott

Canoes were developed over the course of thousands of years by the native peoples of North America. The word 'canoe' originated from the word 'kenu' - meaning dugout. These seagoing boats were used by the Carib Indians of the Caribbean islands, and were made of large tree trunks which were shaped and hollowed, and were strong enough to travel between the islands.

North American Indians are responsible for creating the more well-known version of the canoe - a frame of wooden ribs covered with the lightweight bark of birch trees, and sometimes elm or cedar trees. These boats, which have remained virtually unchanged in design for thousands of years, proved to be ideal for travelling the numerous streams, rivers and lakes of North America.
Birchbark was the perfect choice to build canoes because, not only was it lightweight and smooth, but it was also waterproof and resilient. As well, the birch tree was found in almost every area of Canada, except for the western subarctic region, where spruce bark had to fill in as a substitute.
The joints of the canoes were held together by the root of the white pine and then made waterproof by applying hot pine or spruce resin.
As the commerce of early North America grew, so did the need for canoes. The fur trade became so large, in fact, that the French set up the world's first known canoe factory at Trois-Rivieres, Quebec, around the year 1750. Many of the canoes that fur traders used were capable of carrying a crew of up to 12 people and a cargo weighing around 2400 kilograms.
Two Types of Canoes
There are two types of canoes, the K-boat, or kayak, a closed decked vessel, is generally meant for the use of one person and is propelled by a single paddle with a blade at either end.
The second type of canoe is the more traditional C-boat, or Canadian. The C-boat is manufactured from many different materials, ranging from wood to kevlar. This type of canoe is usually around 17 feet long, a different weight depending on the material used to build it, and meant for two people. The canoeists each use a paddle with a single blade.